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| Author | Topic: Ball Joint Experience |
bbcar  POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 07-28-2004 07:28 PM
    
Took my car in to Reuther Chrysler yesterday for them to install new ball joints today. They called my wife at 10:00 am and said the car was done, I had to wait till after work to pick it up. First thing I noticed when I went to my car was it was dirty, like it had been driven through mud puddles. I checked the ball joint area and everything seemed okay. When I got in and started her up I noticed she had been driven 2 miles. Lunch run or test drive, I don't know. Carpet was also dirty on both sides, Car was spotless when I took her in. At least she is back home and clean again. Steering did not feel any different than before, from what I understand the ball joints are the same as in a Caravan, if so why are Prowlers having problems with them and not Caravans? Barry  This message has been edited by bbcar on 07-28-2004 at 07:28 PM |
jkburns         Prowler Junkie From:Mankato, Minnesota, USA |
posted 07-28-2004 07:30 PM
Barry: Run, don't walk back to that dealership and demand some answers and perhpas even more. In my book, there's no excuse for what I'll describe as "reckless" treatment of your vehicle. I guess this kind of stuff hits a nerve with me. Kevin ------------------ |
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bbcar POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 07-28-2004 07:35 PM
I am sure all I would get is excuses, I should have taken off work and baby sat my car, but a New car dealer should have MORE respect for their customers cars. Barry |
Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 07-29-2004 06:55 AM
I don't think there's harm in a test drive with new ball joints, but why couldn't they put mat protectors down? Cut your losses and be thankful they didn't screw up the recall.... |
idive POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:Texas USA |
posted 07-29-2004 03:02 PM
The front end parts being dirty is common for this. They should clean up the parts after, but typically don't. The test drive is understandable, as few miles as were put on it, but still was a bit gratuitous. But they shouldn't need a passenger to do it, and they should have had floor protectors down from the beginning. I would go back to them and have them clean the carpet, and insist on an answer as to why they felt the need for a passenger, or for anyone to be in the car on the passenger side, and would not leave til you got a direct answer. (To let them know YOU know they had someone in the car that had no business being there.) I had mine in for a radio buzz once. They felt the need to test drive it 6 miles for that? Well, it happens that DC brass was there that day "appreciating" my car. They did me the favor of detailing it before I picked it up, but they left telltale signs behind, like spilled coke on the seat and food bits in the floorboard. A test drive? I think NOT! |
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bbcar POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 07-29-2004 09:04 PM
Just wanted to remind everyone that I work at a Dodge dealership (detailing cars) and we have a Viper mechanic that never takes a Viper out on the street unless it is necessary, any fingerprints or smudges are cleaned by me at his request. Any area of a car that is worked on is cleaned after the repair is completed. All cars are done this way not just Vipers. Any specialty cars are kept inside until delivery back to the customer.(we have a area in the drive thru that holds 4 cars end to end) My prowler sat outside on the lot at Reuthers with the top down. The only time more than 1 person is in a car for a test drive is on a transmission repair and the service manager goes with the mechanic to verify the car shifts properly. Maybe our dealership takes more pride in its service dept. than some of the other dealers. There was a protector on the drivers side but not the passenger side, there was no grease on the floor only dirt and debris dragged in on their shoes. The front suspension on my car was spotless when I took it in as I just cleaned it that weekend and had only driven the car to the dealer for the ball joints. Barry This message has been edited by bbcar on 07-29-2004 at 09:10 PM |
Jim R. POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:Houston,Texas,USA |
posted 07-29-2004 09:13 PM
bbcar MY question to you is why isn't your Dodge dealer servicing your car? My prowler was serviced by my local dodge dealer until the Prowler Tech left. |
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bbcar POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 07-29-2004 11:03 PM
We do not have the required tool kit to properly do the ball joint replacement, otherwise they could have done the recall. Barry |
tangled up in BLUE POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:New Castle, Ind |
posted 07-29-2004 11:17 PM
....our local Viper tech was the guy that took great care.....no test rides with passengers, no test drives at all unless absolutely needed.....no smudges...car locked at all times....never left outside after hours.....scheduled extra time for Vipers...I trusted him with all my Vipers.....the guy was a rare find.....unfortunately we lost him in a motorcycle accident a few weeks ago....Mike died July 4, 2004 This message has been edited by tangled up in BLUE on 07-29-2004 at 11:20 PM |
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-01-2004 10:32 AM
quote: After having a friend who is an ace mechanic come to my garage yesterday and replacing one of my torn ball joints with basic tools, I am now convinced the "Special tool" that is needed for the recall procedure is a LOAD OF STEAMING CRAP! This tool is even responsible for all the people who had steering knuckle scrapes from the recall. That ball joint banged right out like nothing with some carefully well placed taps. He replaced the lower ball joint in about 20 minutes. And since he didn't use that big klugey tool to press out the old ball joint, there was NO scarring left on the knuckle. All I had was scarring from the first time I had the recall done at the dealer. I am so done with dealers.... He took the time to torque everything to spec and only charged me 50 bucks for the trouble. He was disturbed to not see a retainer clip be part of the lower ball joint assy....he said that was a bit odd. Usually there are retainer clips to go on those...he even pointed out the ridge where a retainer clip should go. ONE SET OF BALLJOINTS: $23 |
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bbcar POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 08-02-2004 10:15 AM
Thanks Black Tie 161 - now I will know for next time, I have been thinking of buying a extra set of lower ball joints as I can get a set for 25.00 from a friend of mine. In the past all we ever did was knock out old pressed in ball joints, I read everything on POA about replacing them before I took my car in. Maybe you should inform everyone that this can be done as a home project as long as you have someone that knows what they are doing to do the work. Did your friend suggest that you install the clips on the joints? Thanks Again Barry |
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-03-2004 09:46 AM
quote: I got extra lower front ball joints from MArc at Bryden Motors for $23 a set plus shipping. Great deal. My friend said simply tapping out the old ball joint was easy enough since the arm is just aluminum. he did use a ball joint press to insert the new one. He made the whole job look 100 times easier than the dealers make it look! ....he also recommended spraying the ball joint boot with WD-40 to help prevent dry-rot as he wasn't too impressed with the new ball joint design and materials. My old ball joint had a 2 inch tear in the boot from I don't know what! He didn't put in a retaining clip as there must be a reason for it not to be there...maybe it tears into the aluminum arm? POA is very informamtive, but I refuse to beleive that you need Prowler specific tools to complete some jobs and I don't beleive that jacking the car from one side will trash your frame. |
butchcee POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:Lake Ariel, Pa. |
posted 08-03-2004 10:01 AM
Playing devils advocate, by pressing the old ball joints out with a fixture that will ensure that the are moved out square to the hole will lessen the chance of egging the hole so the new ones will have a tight fit. As was said, the arms are only aluminum. I'm probably nit-picking, but DC has to warrantee the operation and it has to be done the best and most cost effective way possible. |
CJ           POA Lifetime Site Supporter Prowler Junkie Personal ScrapBook From:Rochester Hills, MI USA |
posted 08-03-2004 12:32 PM
And who will be blamed if it isn't done to the specs and with the tools that DC supplied and something goes wrong?? |
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-03-2004 01:25 PM
CJ: I'll tell ya....I'll blame noone but myself, but I'm on my own with this car anyway, so what's the difference? I don't have a service dept within 100 miles that likes Prowlers, or will take the time to properly work on the car... I fully appreciate your POV as you have a certain amaount of corporate loyalty...and I'm sure you would like to feel that every Prowler owner is treated with TLC at the dealer.......BUT in the real world of rural dealers they bang 'em in and get 'em out with not much done right. My (2) service depts I have visited have: Tell me, what glorious dealer service confidence am I missing??? Butchee: Not a single nick or scratch on the A-arm or the hole. And I think it is worth mentioning that it only took one small well directed TAP to bang out the lower ball joint....So it's not that tight in there to begin with. My friend was also very careful not to tap at an angle too. I feel 100 times better having him do the work vs. a dealer at this point. The only thing that ball joint removal tool ensures is that you run a good chance of getting precious parts scratched up with that very same tool. I'm sick and tired of hearing you can only get the proper service from a dealer...that's utter BS. At least in S. Maryland..... I'm looking at the car as a big hot-rod toy that needs to be worked on with TLC...something I can only give it at home or at a trusted local shop. And don't get me started on DC....It states EVERYWHERE in the manual to replace THE WHOLE LOWER A-ARM if there is a problem with the lower ball joint. DC sure as hell found a way to get that recall done cheap didn't they??? they got out of having to manufacture 24,000 lower control arms by inventing the recall kits....going against every statement in the manual. So DC procedures don't help me rest at night anyway.... The story is different for all of you...but for me I'm on my own with this car! This message has been edited by Black Tie 161 on 08-03-2004 at 01:31 PM |
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butchcee POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:Lake Ariel, Pa. |
posted 08-03-2004 03:14 PM
BT--one tap should have told you something--that the ball joint wasn't fitted properly. I would re-think what you told me. I just replaced lowers and uppers in a set of arms that were polished. They had ball joints in them when I got them and I pressed them out before sending off for the work. It took considerable force to press them out using a hydraulic press--especially the uppers. I reassembled them using a 6 inch machinists vise with an appropriate spacer for the joint to pull through. These arms measured .005 interference fit on the uppers, and .004 on the lowers after removing the originals and measuring for the fit of the replacements. Replacing the ball joints a few times will reduce the fit to nothing. Maybe that's why DC wanted to sell them as an assembly in the first place. |
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-04-2004 07:03 AM
Butchee. If that is such a safety concern, why did they make it so just the ball joint can be replaced? To save lotsa money with our safety at the last of considerations, that's why. I have service managers balking at the cause of the ball joint boot failure, and I don't have $700 for a new lower arm. At this point, I hope all the $#@! wheels fall off the car...I just don't care anymore. Maybe I just will get an 05 Mustang and experience a car that doesn't get such lousy support from the manufacturer. I'm getting real pissed at what the warm and fuzzy manuals/ warranties state vs. the real world situations with this car. I have a car I'm afraid to take more than 50 miles from home. |
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butchcee POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:Lake Ariel, Pa. |
posted 08-04-2004 08:04 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Black Tie 161: [B]Butchee. If that is such a safety concern, why did they make it so just the ball joint can be replaced? To save lotsa money with our safety at the last of considerations, that's why.
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-04-2004 08:27 AM
Butchee: My only piece of mind was my friend saying before he did any work: " The control arm is only aluminum, so the ball joint should pop right out." Then the ball joint popped out just as he expected...he didn't seem surprised by the amount of effort needed. the only thing that surprised him was that there is a ridge for a retaining clip on the ball joint, but no retaining clip is mentioned or offered. he thought that was odd. |
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butchcee POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:Lake Ariel, Pa. |
posted 08-04-2004 09:30 AM
My last thought on this subject is that the ease of removal is based on the fit, not the material--good luck. |
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-04-2004 09:58 AM
quote: I'll need it with this car, Butchee... : |
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bbcar POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 08-04-2004 03:07 PM
Hey Black Tie 161 before you go running to buy a Ford Mustang go to svtperformance.com and look around at the complaints of warranty refusal and problems that Ford will not repair (or can't) such as what they call engine TICK, a knocking noise that comes from the left rear of the engine and so far all attempts of Ford to repair this have failed. Not all Mustang have this problem but apparently quite a few do. I think all the manufactures are looking for ways to cut costs on warranty repairs, and warranty refusals is a easy way to do this, so is replacing a joint rather that the whole lower arm, I dont think it is fair that DC does not want to sell just the joint to the customer, however they feel it is acceptable for them to do just that as a recall. Barry |
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Black Tie 161 POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:MD, USA |
posted 08-05-2004 07:03 AM
bbcar: You are right...ALL car manufacturers are guilty of similar practices. IE: Go to any GM car lot and count how many windows are taped up because GM switched to cheaper window regulators that fail on 04's not even sold yet! |
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bbcar POA Site Supporter Prowler Junkie From:St. Louis, Mo. U.S.A. |
posted 08-05-2004 08:51 AM
Thats nice to know. Barry |
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