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Author Topic:   Gas Prices - Who's Making Money?
Bob Miller
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4576
From: Alexandria, Virginian USA
Registered: OCT 2003

posted 09-25-2005 10:45 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bob Miller     
This following is an excerpt from the Sunday Washington Post. Most of you already know this but I thought it was still interesting.

"With the recent upsurge in gas prices, who has increased their prices?
- Domestic & foreign companies that pump the crude from the ground and the tankers, pipelines or rail transport of crude to refiners - up 46%
- Refineries - up 255%
- Distributors and Retailers - up 5%
- Consumers - up 64% (on average our cost for gas has risen my this amount)

When the average price of a gallon of regular gas peaked at $3.07 recently, it was partly because the nation's refineries were getting an estimated 99 cents on each gallon sold. That was more than three times the amount they earned a year ago when regular unleaded was selling for $1.87.
The companies that pump oil from he ground wept in an additional 47 cents on each gallon, a 46% increase over the same period a year ago.
If motorists are the big losers in the spectacular run-up in gas prices, the companies that produce the oil and turn it into gasoline are the clear winners. By contracts, the truckers who transport gasoline, the companies that operate pipelines and the gas station owners have profited far less.
The spike caused by Hurricane Katrina (which heavily damaged oil production and refining in the gulf region) accentuated gains the refiners and producers already were enjoying over the past year. Exxon-Mobil Corp., the Irving, Texas behemoth that produces and refines oil, reported in July 2005 that its second quarter profit was up 32 percent over last year, to $7.64 billion. Analysis expect Exxon's profit to soar again this quarter.
For a company like Exxon, producing a barrel of oil from an existing well costs about $20, according to analysts. When the selling price rises above that, the increase is almost all profit, they said. After Katrina bore down on the Gulf Coast, the price of oil set a new high, approaching $70.
Refiners processing the oil into gasoline faced lucrative market conditions. They may have had to pay the producers more for the oil, but they were able to sell their gasoline for higher prices as a result of the short supply and the spike on the mercantile exchange. In their view, the increases were justified because the market dictated that their final product (gasoline) had risen in value.
Refiners, particularly those with most of their facilities outside the past of Katrina, cashing in. Analysts predicted a windfall for companies such as Philadelphia-based Sunoco Inc., which continued operating normally during the hurricane.
After gasoline leaves the refineries, the profit market becomes narrower, even when prices are high. Many motorists direct their anger at gas station owners, but the bulk of the increase at the pump typically is not making station owners rich, analysts say."

Boy, I'm sure glad this Congress and President gave the big oil companies a massive tax break in July 2005 so they could make through these difficult times....

This message has been edited by Bob Miller on 09-25-2005 at 10:46 AM

Bcoffman Gray Ghost
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 2418
From: Marshall,Mo.65340
Registered: DEC 2002

posted 09-25-2005 03:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bcoffman Gray Ghost     
What has me frazzled is the Ethynol prices. A bushel of corn is about the same as it has been for several years. The costs of manufacturing a gallon of Ethynol have only raised a much smaller amount. Yet the price at the pump for the 85 per-cent Ethynol has jumped right along with the price of gasoline.


Tom Santella
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 1484
From: Sandy Hook Ct. USA
Registered: DEC 2002

posted 09-25-2005 04:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Tom Santella     
Randy says the middle guys get shafted the worst, and I believe him.

------------------
BackinBlack


Randy Cobb
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4070
From: Greensboro, NC
Registered: JUL 2002

posted 09-26-2005 08:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randy Cobb     
I have always avoided posting this, because you never know who may see a particular post and at a time like this when a supplier can control who does and who does not get supply a distributor like me has to be extremely careful, but.....

The truth:
In the distribution chain -
Distributors, retailers and consumers are getting hosed. Consumers worse than any segment. Retailers have a slightly higher margins than normal, but increased driveoffs &/or thefts are taking this away. I have one dealer who has to have security 24/7 to prevent driveoffs. By law in his county he can not impose pre-pay.

Traders, crude extractors and refiners are TONNING it!
I am on a distributor council for a major oil company and at a meeting last week they told of how capital intense the business is (smoke screen BS), but that they are having high profits and would love to invest in more refining capacity, but can't get clearance on over 30 proposed expansion projects.

Yes the major oil companies are raping us, but when will we as a nation learn that we must conserve and at the same time allow refining and distribution expansion?


Randy Cobb
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4070
From: Greensboro, NC
Registered: JUL 2002

posted 09-26-2005 09:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randy Cobb     
Bob-
I'm pro-business, believe in Republican principles and am very pro-Bush, but I strongly believe the FTC allowing the oil co. mega-mergers was a horrendous mistake.

Tom-
Thanks for the comment.


Marty Usher
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 13833
From: San Antonio, Texas
Registered: JUN 2001

posted 09-26-2005 09:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Marty Usher     
I believe refining capacity is a major issue at this time. If the oil companies are making big $$$ from the consumers it would nice if they were allowed to expand refining capacity.

I have heard of one proposal for the government to offer tax credits to property owners curently using home heating oil to swicth over to some alternative heating method. This would free up more refining capacity for gasoline/diesel.

I agree with Randy that more conservation is needed as well. I'm surprised we are so far behind europe in acceptance of the newer diesel engines for everyday driving.

This message has been edited by Marty Usher on 09-26-2005 at 09:17 AM

Randy Cobb
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4070
From: Greensboro, NC
Registered: JUL 2002

posted 09-26-2005 09:40 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randy Cobb     
Marty-
There are sales tax exemptions now available for switching from oil heat to alternate sourses and also vouchers for up to $1,000 from some HVAC unit manufacturers. The problem is that the most available of these alternatives, natural gas and propane, are raising their prices in lock step with oil and are a less efficient heating source (BTUs per dollar are less).

We are switching about 5 - 8 customers a month from oil to propane or natural gas and try to show them that oil is more efficent, but they still change. After trying to educate them, we give the customer what they want. We supply all three, so we will still retain them as a customer anyway. We make more money on the lesser efficent source, so we only debate them so much.

Marty Usher
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 13833
From: San Antonio, Texas
Registered: JUN 2001

posted 09-26-2005 09:58 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Marty Usher     
Randy - I had no data on the efficiency of propane or natural gas nor price comparison, both of which would have relevance in a decision to change over.

I certainly can see an advantage in keeping refining capacity for gasoline/diesel fuel.

Then again, everyone in the Northern climates could move South for the winter months!


TooHipCat
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4173
From: Londonderry,NH
Registered: MAR 2004

posted 09-26-2005 10:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for TooHipCat     
Thanks for the article Bob but when it comes to info regarding the petroleum industry, I try and get my facts from Randy.

He will always tell you the way it REALLY is...unlike the biased and ALWAYS depressing media.

Brian

Bob Miller
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4576
From: Alexandria, Virginian USA
Registered: OCT 2003

posted 09-26-2005 10:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Bob Miller     
Too Hip - You're right on that Randy is a valuable and honest source of information on this subject. It doesn't appear that he disputes the magnitude of oil company profits.

I'm also pro-business; of all sizes. They are the engine that has powered the US for well over 100 years. It just seems to me that when we the public and industry are getting screwed, we should be able to rely on the federal government to look out for our interests, rather than making the problem worse...

I'm sure I am not even aware of all the alternative sources of energy for home heating and auto fuel, but we really should get busy figuring out which is most economically practical.

Randy Cobb
Prowler Junkie

Posts: 4070
From: Greensboro, NC
Registered: JUL 2002

posted 09-27-2005 10:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Randy Cobb     
Thanks for the positive comments guys.

I will give you the honest scoop. I have no reason to do other than that, plus I'm too dumb to lie!

I forgot another biz segmant that is loving the high gas prices. The credit card issuers/processors and banks.

With these price increases the percentage of credit card usage for gas transactions has risen from approx. 70% to appox. 80%. The credit card fees are on average at 2.5% of dollar sales. Their take on sales have increased proportionatly along with gas price increases without extending any effort (overhead).

I have some dealers that may be making 5 cents per gallon and in turn have to pay 7 cents for credit card fees on that gallon.

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