Author
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Topic: New gun laws in Australian,,,happy criminals
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Gary C Prowler Junkie Posts: 12017 From: San Diego Area Registered: JUL 2000
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posted 08-26-2002 07:49 PM
Interesting Australian Gun Confiscation Results are IN! Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from Down-Under. It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced by a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $50 million dollars. The first year results are now in: Australia-wide, homicides are up 3.2 percent; Australia-wide, assaults are up 8.6 percent; Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes,44 percent!). In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent. (Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not and criminals still possess their guns!) While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed. There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the elderly. Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in "successfully ridding Australian society of guns." You won't see this data on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the state Assembly disseminating this information. The Australian experience proves it. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect only the law-abiding citizens. Take note Americans, before it's to late! PLEASE FORWARD TO EVERYONE ON YOUR EMAIL LIST! DON'T BE A MEMBER OF THE SILENT MAJORITY AND LET THE VOCAL MINORITY LET THIS HAPPEN IN THE USA. Just got this emailed to me, thought some of you would like to see it.
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ed monahan Prowler Junkie Posts: 33595 From: Cincinnati, OH Registered: JUL 2000
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posted 08-27-2002 12:04 AM
Gary, don't forget that Australia was started basically as a penal colony for convicts. WE would never have those problems in our country with all of our upstanding citizens! lol. Yeah, RIGHT.
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Rich Tilden Prowler Junkie Posts: 343 From: Punta Gorda, Florida Registered: JUL 2000
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posted 08-27-2002 09:41 AM
Gary, This e-mail has been circulating for some time now. Here are a few comments from Snopes: "In the specific case offered here, context is the most important factor. The piece quoted above leads the reader to believe that much of the Australian citizenry owned handguns until their ownership was made illegal and all firearms owned by "law-abiding citizens" were collected by the government through a buy-back program in 1997. This is not so. Australian citizens do not (and never did) have a constitutional right to own firearms -- even before the 1997 buyback program, handgun ownership in Australia was restricted to certain groups, such as those needing weapons for occupational reasons, members of approved sporting clubs, hunters, and collectors. Moreover, the 1997 buyback program did not take away all the guns owned by these groups; only some types of firearms (primarily semi-automatic and pump-action weapons) were banned. And even with the ban in effect, those who can demonstrate a legitimate need to possess prohibited categories of firearms can petition for exemptions from the law. Given this context, any claims based on statistics (even accurate ones) which posit a cause-and-effect relationship between the gun buyback program and increased crime rates because "criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed" are automatically suspect, since the average Australian citizen didn't own firearms even before the buyback. But beyond that, most of the statistics offered here are misleading and present only "first year results" where long-term trends need to be considered in order to draw valid cause-and-effect conclusions. The main point to be learned here is that determining the effect of changes in Australia's gun ownership laws and the government's firearm buy-back program on crime rates requires a complex long-term analysis and can't be discerned from the small, mixed grab bag of short-term statistics offered here. And no matter what the outcome of that analysis, the results aren't necessarily applicable to the USA, where laws regarding gun ownership are (and always have been) much different than those in Australia."
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Gary C Prowler Junkie Posts: 12017 From: San Diego Area Registered: JUL 2000
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posted 08-27-2002 12:56 PM
Thanks Rich, there is always two or more sides to any story, thanks.
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growl Prowler Junkie Posts: 162 From: San Ramon, CA Registered: MAR 2002
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posted 08-27-2002 09:48 PM
Hey Rich, Which ones weren't armed? You're a criminal...guess! The Swiss statistics prove you wrong. They ALL have (machine) guns and the lowest crime rate in the world. The problem is culture, IQ and testosterone. Gun laws disarm the wrong people. ~bg
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Rich Tilden Prowler Junkie Posts: 343 From: Punta Gorda, Florida Registered: JUL 2000
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posted 08-28-2002 08:05 AM
Hey Growl, I was just pointing out some facts about Australia - namely: "Claim: Statistics demonstrate that crime rates in Australia have increased substantially since the government there instituted a gun buy-back program in 1997. Status: False" As for Switzerland, I don't have any data and you haven't offered any. You're an engineer and should be relying on statistical truths more than me. (I do doubt however that all Swiss have automatic weapons.)
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growl Prowler Junkie Posts: 162 From: San Ramon, CA Registered: MAR 2002
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posted 08-28-2002 11:53 AM
>I will let a Swiss native answer:From luginbu@ifi.unizh.ch (Andreas Luginbuehl) "About the "Swiss Reserve": Since we don't have a standing professional army, basically everybody - except the top leadership and the pro instructors - is "reserve". In Switzerland, one does 4 months of basic training at the age of 20, then 3 weeks "repetition course" every year till 32, then 2 week repetition courses at larger intervalls till 50. (This is about to change slightly now with the armed forces reforms under way). Since everybody keeps the basic personal equipment at home, all men doing military service, from the age of 20 until 50, have their personal weapon, plus _sealed_ ammunition, at home. This is a SIG 9 mm pistol for officers and a 5.5 mm SIG automatic assault rifle (Sturmgewehr 90) for virtually everybody else. (Officers can have a Stgw90 on loan, in addition to the pistol). There still are units which are equipped with the older Sturmgewehr 57. The personal weapon is on loan, but may be purchased at the moment that the army gear is given back, at the age of 50. By the way: There are mandatory shooting exercises to be done once every year. This is done at the local shooting range, not during military service, and therefore, Swiss men usually have some privately purchased ammo around and the weapons get used regularly." Yes I can bury you under statistics but, I won't. ~bg
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