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Author Topic:   The GOP Tax Myth
reechee




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posted 10-20-2017 03:25 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for reechee     send a private message to reechee   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by reechee
I helped create the GOP tax myth. Trump is wrong: Tax cuts don’t equal growth.


The best growth in recent memory came after President Bill Clinton raised taxes in the ’90s.

By Bruce Bartlett

Bruce Bartlett was a domestic policy adviser to President Ronald Reagan. He is the author of “The Benefit and the Burden: Tax Reform — Why We Need It and What It Will Take."


Four decades ago, while working for Rep. Jack Kemp (R-N.Y.), I had a hand in creating the Republican tax myth. Of course, it didn’t seem like a myth at that time — taxes were rising rapidly because of inflation and bracket creep, the top tax rate was 70 percent and the economy seemed trapped in stagflation with no way out. Tax cuts, at that time, were an appropriate remedy for the economy’s ills. By the time Ronald Reagan was president, Republican tax gospel went something like this:

The tax system has an enormously powerful effect on economic growth and employment.
High taxes and tax rates were largely responsible for stagflation in the 1970s.
Reagan’s 1981 tax cut, which was based a bill, co-sponsored by Kemp and Sen. William Roth (R-Del.), that I helped design, unleashed the American economy and led to an abundance of growth.
Based on this logic, tax cuts became the GOP’s go-to solution for nearly every economic problem. Extravagant claims are made for any proposed tax cut. Wednesday, President Trump argued that “our country and our economy cannot take off” without the kind of tax reform he proposes. Last week, Republican economist Arthur Laffer said, “If you cut that [corporate] tax rate to 15 percent, it will pay for itself many times over. … This will bring in probably $1.5 trillion net by itself.”

That’s wishful thinking. So is most Republican rhetoric around tax cutting. In reality, there’s no evidence that a tax cut now would spur growth.

The rest of the story:

http://www.w ashingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2017/09/28/i-helped-create-the-gop-tax-myth-trump-is-wrong-tax-cuts-dont-equal-growth/?utm_term=.8fec8cf36158

This message has been edited by reechee on 10-20-2017 at 03:25 PM

ALLEY CAT





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posted 10-20-2017 03:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ALLEY CAT     send a private message to ALLEY CAT   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by ALLEY CAT
quote: "Based on this logic, tax cuts became the GOP’s go-to solution for nearly every economic problem."


So the Liberal logic, raise taxes and spend more on Welfare benefits, wasteful Federal projects, free Healthcare, and Education (we see how that works out ), is the answer?

.

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This message has been edited by ALLEY CAT on 10-20-2017 at 03:49 PM

reechee




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posted 10-20-2017 04:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for reechee     send a private message to reechee   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by reechee
Unfortunately AC you do not rebut any of the assertions in the initial statements.
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posted 10-20-2017 05:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Landscape Doctor     send a private message to Landscape Doctor   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by Landscape Doctor
End all taxes,,, institute a consumption tax,,, EVERYONE PAYS.

What say you reechee???????????

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posted 10-20-2017 05:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Landscape Doctor     send a private message to Landscape Doctor   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by Landscape Doctor
Oh before I forget. The Washington Post is a left leaning rag,,, just like snoops.
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posted 10-20-2017 05:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Landscape Doctor     send a private message to Landscape Doctor   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by Landscape Doctor
Go on my test post thread to see what I have for desert tonight.
reechee




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posted 10-23-2017 05:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for reechee     send a private message to reechee   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by reechee
LD, I know that neither The WAPO nor Snopes have the imprimatur of the right nevertheless, I hope you noted the author worked for Reagan.
What Are the Cons of a Consumption Tax?

1. To replace traditional tax structures, it would need to be quite high.
Most estimates for the inclusion of a consumption tax in the United States peg the estimated rate to be at 23-34% on the purchases of all qualifying goods. If your $100 item suddenly costs $134, that might discourage people from making a purchase.

2. For a consumption tax to actually work, it must tax everything.
Nothing is off-limits for a consumption tax, with the exception of used goods. This means food, water, and other basic essentials also get that huge tax. Homeowners would be taxed on their mortgage interest. Students would be taxed on their student loans. People would get more money, but they’d have to spend more money as well.

3. It places a higher level of burden on the poor for tax revenues.
Poor households don’t typically have investments. This means their income is subjected to a higher overall percentage of taxation because they’re paying taxes on items they need. If a family making $20k per year pays $2,000 in taxes and so does a household making $200,000 per year, they might pay the same amount, but the poor family is paying 10% of their income in taxes and the wealthier family is paying just 1%.

4. The cost of used goods will explode.
This is a basic supply and demand principle. If new products are subjected to a tax of up to 34%, more people will look at purchasing used goods to avoid that tax. This will cause the price of used goods to rise because more people want them. In the end, more money winds up changing hands, but everyone ends up paying more to get the same things they need.

5. Some retirees could be taxed twice.
Some retirement income, like in a Roth IRA, has already been taxed. Upon withdrawal, under a consumption tax, those same funds would be taxed again for the same purpose.

Facts have a liberal bias.

ed monahan





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posted 10-23-2017 06:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ed monahan     send a private message to ed monahan   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by ed monahan
Tax on mortgage interest !!!!! Really. That sounds like a real far LEFT scare tactic. I guess you would have to pay tax on your real estate tax, also.
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posted 10-23-2017 08:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for StingRay     send a private message to StingRay   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by StingRay
Ed, the Left will tax your taxes if they can ... all so the likes of Birnie can buy another Audi supercar and another mansion and Al Gore can increase his carbon footprint all while denouncing republicans that don't rank the "dangers" of global warming as high as ISIS and radical Islamic Terrorists ....
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posted 10-25-2017 09:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mslc10     send a private message to mslc10   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by mslc10
ummmm, did you forget clinton had the dotcom bubble spurred on by the Reagan era? Remember in the 80's movies all the electronics/computer advances? Chk these trailers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNiZP2G-nEM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbqMuvnx5MU

Landscape Doctor



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posted 10-25-2017 03:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Landscape Doctor     send a private message to Landscape Doctor   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by Landscape Doctor
Tom to sum up your post,, looks like liberal scare tactic fuzzy math to me.

Also at least you made my point that middle class gets screwed. The bottom leach off the system on middle class backs.

I still say 20% consumption tax. JMHO

Oops,,, correction, I meant reechee not Tom.

This message has been edited by Landscape Doctor on 10-26-2017 at 04:37 PM

cstall




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posted 10-26-2017 04:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cstall     send a private message to cstall   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by cstall
Hey Reech -

I read your article - nice piece.
But there's a question the author doesn't address:
If tax cuts don't spur economic growth, what does?

bcsnave

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posted 10-27-2017 01:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for bcsnave     send a private message to bcsnave   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by bcsnave
?

This message has been edited by bcsnave on 04-10-2018 at 10:28 PM

reechee




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posted 10-27-2017 04:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for reechee     send a private message to reechee   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by reechee
cstall, I'm glad you actually read the article. I can only hazard a guess since I only took the minimal econ requirements in school (Macro and MIcro econ). My life observations seem to indicate that a prosperous economy is a good mix of private and public investments with an eye toward fairness.

With the debacle that Kansas had with their tax cuts, I cannot see how anybody can seriously purport to believe this works. Reagan had to raise taxes multiple times after his cuts grew large deficits and Bush Senior also raised taxes for which he paid a big price.

Do you have any thoughts on what makes a healthy economy?

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posted 10-27-2017 04:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for StingRay     send a private message to StingRay   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by StingRay
Reechee .... ever learn about "control spending", or "curtail wasteful or abused programs" in either of those econ classes ... Tax & Spend seems to be the Democratic mantra ...I like bcsnave's approach ... if we all join him, who will be left to fund it all?
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posted 10-27-2017 05:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for reechee     send a private message to reechee   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by reechee
StingRay,

I am certainly not opposed to curtailing wasteful spending. I do think that all too often programs continue simply from inertia. For instance we still have a Wool and Mohair Marketing Assistance and of course every time a proposal is made to kill it, the lobbyists come out in force. That is why I feel every program should have a sunset date. If it is not renewed, it dies.

As far as Tax and Spend, that is an old canard which is really meaningless. A country has expenses. It raises taxes and them spends. It is superior to the Republican system of Borrow and Spend.

bcsnave is certainly welcome to try his plan. I doubt if he would enjoy the Obama Platinum Plan. Perhaps he could provide details of what that is.

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posted 10-27-2017 06:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ed monahan     send a private message to ed monahan   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by ed monahan
"It is superior to the Republican system of Borrow and Spend."

It is good to see you have a sense of humor. lol

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posted 10-27-2017 07:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mslc10     send a private message to mslc10   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by mslc10
I'm sorry but who was borrowing and spending in the last 8 years?

It's the swamp and any govt. really , even locals. The old story of " well we spent this much last year, we have to spend it this year too or we will loose it. " I believe it's called baseline budgeting . http://www.cagw.org/content/baseline-budgeting

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posted 10-27-2017 07:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for alprowl     send a private message to alprowl   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by alprowl
quote:
Originally posted by mslc10:

It's the swamp and any govt. really , even locals. The old story of " well we spent this much last year, we have to spend it this year too or we will loose it. " I believe it's called baseline budgeting ...


This is nothing new...in the late 60s and 70s, when I was in the new car business we would win contracts to sell vehicles to schools, municipalities and police depts... The vehicles were set prices on certain specs... Many towns would request 'changes' and offer to pay overinflated prices just to use up as much $ as possible before the end of the fiscal budget year.
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posted 10-27-2017 10:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dano     send a private message to Dano   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by Dano
quote:
Originally posted by reechee:
It is superior to the Republican system of Borrow and Spend.


Can someone please remind me which party the president belonged to that had the largest increase to the national debt IN HISTORY ? The reason this debt is there in the first place is because of borrow and spend.

This message has been edited by Dano on 10-27-2017 at 10:17 PM

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posted 10-27-2017 10:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for StingRay     send a private message to StingRay   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by StingRay
quote:
Originally posted by mslc10:
... The old story of " well we spent this much last year, we have to spend it this year too or we will loose it. " ...


THIS in a nutshell is the problem ... the idea of a budget is to put a cap on what you expect to spend. The GOAL should be to spend under it - well under it, and then the following year the budget can be reduced ... instead of this BS approach of "must spend it or lose it" and then next year they MUST increase it by CPI or some other measure of inflation - its a scam and without a STOP put to it, its a runaway train!

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posted 10-27-2017 10:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Landscape Doctor     send a private message to Landscape Doctor   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by Landscape Doctor
quote:
Originally posted by alprowl:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by mslc10:
[B]
It's the swamp and any govt. really , even locals. The old story of " well we spent this much last year, we have to spend it this year too or we will loose it. " I believe it's called baseline budgeting ...


This is nothing new...in the late 60s and 70s, when I was in the new car business we would win contracts to sell vehicles to schools, municipalities and police depts... The vehicles were set prices on certain specs... Many towns would request 'changes' and offer to pay overinflated prices just to use up as much $ as possible before the end of the fiscal budget year.[/B][/QUOTE]


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
And then the next time they purchase vehicles they bilk the taxpayer for the same amount as last time and then deal with the car seller for a lower cost and someone in the town gets extra money in there pocket on the taxpayers wallet. Bait and switch.

This message has been edited by Landscape Doctor on 10-27-2017 at 10:29 PM

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posted 10-28-2017 11:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mslc10     send a private message to mslc10   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by mslc10
And don't get fooled by the so called " balanced budget" ! All that means is they ( govt) will just tax us beyond what they spend and call it a " surplus" and then spend the extra , hence balancing the budget!

Wait ...I think I remember a president one time " refunding" us " our" money when there was a surplus. Seemed to me their was a boost in the economy at the same time........hmmmmm.
( sarcasm intended)

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posted 10-28-2017 03:00 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ed monahan     send a private message to ed monahan   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by ed monahan
Cincinnati ENQUIRER today.
by Bill Laverty.
I can't seem to find it online to cut and paste so I will just type in the last paragraph.

Will the Trump tax plan work? The Democrats need to look no further than their own party to answer that question. Democrats adopted an almost identical plan in 1964 when Pres. Lyndon Johnson/JFK with strong BIPARTISAN support from Congress, passed the Tax Reduction Act. This plan led to an economic boom that lasted a decade.

ed monahan





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posted 10-28-2017 06:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ed monahan     send a private message to ed monahan   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote   Search for more posts by ed monahan
One more paragraph that hits the nail on the head.

Under Pres. Barack Obama, for the FIRST TIME in U S history, more small companies went out of business than were started. That is not only bad for (the business owners). It's disastrous for you.

In other words, the total of small businesses was lower than when he took office. Eight years of negative growth.
The middle class saw their average income drop 4.6 percent and their net worth decrease by 19 percent.


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